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Smith and Wesson Model 642
Liberals, we need to have a heart to heart about gun politics: There will be no new gun control laws. Gun manufacturers, through the NRA and other trade groups, have a complete lock on our federal government.... Read more»
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10 comments on this story
I think your ideas are mostly on target, but you give way too much credit to the NRA. They are only the legends the left has made them. They don’t vote, and are at most three to four million single issue voters.
Where I think you missed the point is that most Americans don’t have a problem with gun ownership. They don’t need the NRA to tell them how to feel, they want the option of buying a gun if they want to do it.
Maybe we should focus on keeping the guns out of the seriously mental ill’s hands and away from criminals. There is a lot of work to do in that regard, so maybe we should try harder. I would bet that would have a real and measureable impact.
Also worth noting is how many injuries and deaths occur each year in gun accidents. In addition to DUIEXPERT’s suggestions re mental health screenings and other barriers to gun ownership by nutjobs, a lot of work can be done in the area of gun safety. The New York Times’s Nicholas Kristof wrote a good column on that today:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/26/opinion/kristof-safe-from-fire-but-not-gone.html?_r=1&nl=todaysheadlines&emc=edit_ae_20120726
Zuma once again shows that he leans heavily toward the “Stupid” part of his column title. That isn’t to say that this piece is wall-to-wall idiocy, but most of it was.
As usual, Zuma doesn’t let facts get in the way of a good piece. He fails to mention one group of gun owners…the kind that want it for personal protection. He mentions these people, sort of, the Dale Gribble on King of the Hill types. But he doesn’t mention those who want to protect their person and their homes and who don’t think the sky is falling. There are many of those people around.
In today’s society where the justice system caudles criminals instead of punishes them, and police response times can take hours, the need for a gun is greater today then it has been in the last 75 years or so. Imagine if someone would have used their gun at Safeway…then Loughner would have actually been held accountable for what he did, and we wouldn’t have to endure this circus with Larry Burns as ringmaster for a year and a half now…and counting.
Perhaps Zuma recommends a ban on guns like Mexico has…and it’s working really well down there, isn’t it? It’s an old argument, but an air-tight one, as well…if you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have guns. When you make a law, it only affects law-abiding citizens. Your criminals and your crazies are going to find a way to obtain guns and ammunition regardless of what laws and what rights are on the books. As I commented in another opinion piece, my rights should not be trampled because someone else is an asshole.
The framers of the Constitution knew what they were doing when they wrote the Second Amendment. They knew that an armed citizenry would keep the government in check. Now, Zuma and other Obama supporters obviously prefer the tyrannical approach to government, but that’s not what our Founding Fathers wanted.
As to Holder, the contempt vote was the right thing to do, regardless of NRA commentary or involvement. That was a stupid, idiotic plan which resulted in the death of at least two of our own. Those involved with Fast and Furious would be held criminally liable if there were any justice around here.
I hit submit too soon…
What Zuma and his ilk either don’t get, or can’t sell, is that it’s about a balance of power. The bad guys are going to arm themselves, so the good guys must do the same or the bad guys are going to take over.
Oh, and as a matter of disclosure…I’m not a gun owner. I don’t even particularly care for guns. However, I am a big fan of the Bill of Rights, and I don’t feel it should be changed, disregarded, or outright trampled just because idiots like Zuma say it should.
@Bret Linden
Guns aren’t banned in Mexico. Handguns up to a .38, shotguns and rifles are all legal, as are private-party sales.
I don’t know the current state of Jimmy’s arsenal - I’ll let him speak to that - but I do know he’s got a bit of familiarity with a firearm or two.
Food for thought (for everyone, not just Bret): Why is it the same people who treat the 2nd Amendment as sacrosanct and an individual right to bear arms as absolute are generally the same people who are fine when the 1st Amendment is restricted when it comes to Occupy protestors?
Occupy protesters weren’t saying anything that a reasonable person can discern. There was no free speech to protect. As to the right to assemble, non-occupiers also have a right to assemble, and their rights were being imposed upon by the occupiers.
As a young person I was a competetive shooter on the NRA national headquarters junior team, Pinwheel JRC.
Today I own a pump shotgun (a family gun circa 1920s, its a goose gun with a cut down barrel) and my old Anschutz target rifle, a .22. I have lots of iron-sight time on ARs and AKs and some target experience with a scoped Model 700. There is not a class of handgun I haven’t shot, short and long barrel revolvers, and SA and DA semi-autos. I like guns.
Ordinary gun owners fall, I think, into the third group.
And the first amendment applies equally to jibberish as it does to the kind of speech that Bret scores as relevant. But I suspect he wasn’t listening so closely to what the Occupiers had to say. Just a guess.
My best to all,
Jimmy
I’m not trying to hijack this or anything. I don’t want to change the topic, so I’m just going to make this particular request of Jimmy, Dylan, and other like-minded people who actually mistakenly think the occupiers were doing something productive, or that it was something that even came remotely close to “free speech”.
I want you to do an experiment. If you want to share the results with me I’d love to hear them, but it’s important that YOU know the results of this experiment, not me. Over the next two or three weeks, when you’re speaking one-on-one with friends or acquaintances, I’d like to you take the conversation in the direction of occupiers, and ask your conversation partner what they thought the message was that the occupiers were trying to convey. Don’t steer them or guide them, just ask a general, open-ended question and see what your friend says. Make a mental note of what your friend says, or even go so far as to jot it down for future reference.
I’d like you to do this with maybe six or seven people. When the experiment is over, see if any two of these people give you a similar answer. I would be very surprised if they did. I honestly, wholeheartedly believe that if you ask seven different people you’d get seven totally different answers. You don’t have to take my word for it…go on youtube and search occupy tucson and see how all-over-the-place these people are, and how incoherent most of them sound. One talking head described the occupy thing as if you take every liberal cause and put it in a blender, the occupy thing is the goo that would come out. I think that description is accurate.
And, again, I’ll understand if you’re too embarrassed to admit that I was right about this one, you can keep it to yourself. I don’t need to know that I was right, I just need you guys to understand what horrendous disorganized idiocy and noise the occupy thing was, but more than that, I need you guys to understand that the key word in the term “free speech” is “speech”...it’s not protected if you’re not saying anything.
And, for the record…if they did actually convey a coherent message (and yes Jimmy, I was listening and trying to pick out what the hell they were talking about), then I would be defending their rights alongside you.
Again, not trying to hijack the topic, so in this particular post will be my final response in this thread referencing the flea party.
“There are three levels of crazy in the gun community” was where Jimmy indicated that he has no idea who he is talking about, what they think or feel, and no interest in finding out. The biggest issue that we face today is that need to win, or beat the opposition in a contest that combines dick-size and Keyboard Kommando tactics.
(And that goes for whomever tossed the ‘occupiers’ non-sequitur grenade too.)
The problem is that Jimmy and his look at the tragedy and see a gun doing harm, carried by a person. I see a person doing harm,carrying a gun. The problem is that the person is desperately trying to influence things using a tool. He’s nuts, granted, but you have decided that it’s the tool that he has chosen that is the issue, not the society that drove him nuts, and is too cheap (selfish, actually) to help him to not be a danger.
There are forty-million gun owners in this country, a vast majority of which fall into the third category; sportsmen, hunters, target shooting enthusiasts, plinkers, etc. None of them has ever entertained the thought of using their gun to harm another human being. To suggest that they have their gun rights removed to insure that crazy people have to use their second choice of dangerous tool to harm people is ludicrous.
It would take a lot less effort to get Congress to pass legislation to insure that crazy people get help, and the at desperate people have a shot at economic security, than it will to get them to change the Constitution. It would take less red tape, and fewer dollars. Plus it would see less opposition (still a lot, but less).
Not to mention that there would be great side effects, only one of which would be a huge reduction in violent crime. ALL violent crime.
And he’s forgotten the fourth group. They are a small group that has taken the Founding Fathers seriously, They keep guns in their homes; not to shoot, to hunt, for sport, or to harm others, but as a symbol to the Powers-That-Be that United States citizens are, and have a right to be armed in case that power decide to become tyrannical. And they may have to take Jefferson’s advice, “The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions that I wish it to be always kept alive.” Which was in response to, “Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms (of government) those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny”.
To these, he predicted that revolution would, and should be about every generation.
Geez Brett,
What does Obama have to do with any of this? Sounds like you don’t like him. What does he have to do with gun control? As far as I know, he has increased the rights of gun owners to carry in National Parks. Why don’t you leave him out of your rant?